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Old 28 July 2004, 14:06   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jono
Remind me who said that?.....
Daniel TD5. I have to say I agree with Windchill and this guy's worth listening to - he could afford to buy Land Rover outright


ps. sorry, Richard
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Old 28 July 2004, 14:38   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Davies
Daniel TD5. I have to say I agree with Windchill and this guy's worth listening to - he could afford to buy Land Rover outright


ps. sorry, Richard
As windchill said

As for being a poor man's RR - BOLLOCKS!! I bough my wife's out of choice as I believe the engine particularly to be considerably better than anything RR have to offer.

Choice being The word

i still think the overland is a rangerover wannbe as are most big 4X4 but
now the wannbes seem to come very close to the mark as landrover fall lower and lower with all aspects of product range

dan
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Old 28 July 2004, 14:49   #43
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I've only just picked......

...up on this thread and thought the following may amuse.

About two weeks ago in Abersoch I saw a big black shiny 04 plated RR being towed by Disco who had also broken down and was in turn just about to accept a tow from a JEEP. Upon reflection, I really wish I'd taken a photo as it would have no doubt won some sort of "readers photos" prize in a Landi or 4x4 Magazine.

With all that's been said by people with a lot more experience and knowledge than me, may I interject with the vain statement of the obvious "Street Cred'". The RR wins hands down on the Grandiose Scale.
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Old 28 July 2004, 15:18   #44
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Only just caught on to this thread.

I agree 0-60 in 30.6 seconds is definatly wrong, are you sure they didn't mean months!
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Old 28 July 2004, 16:31   #45
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Originally Posted by Phil Davies
...and there I was thinking it had something to do with the industry's inability to compete competitively with foreign manufacturers, management's failure to instigate effective restructuring measures in response to declining markets and increasing global competition, failure to adequately develop export distribution networks, failure to incorporate the requisite technological advances into production processes, oh and of course its repeated inability to make reliable cars. Shows how wrong you can be, doesn't it?
No I am on about the amazing ability of British people to run this country down at every possible opportunity for whatever reason they can find.

Are you telling me that FIAT built wonderfull cars back in the 70s and 80s - or Citreon or Renault? Remember the 2cv and Renault 4? Remember the FIAT 126 and 124? And yet Italians and the French keep buying vast numbers of their cars!

Dennis fire engines are fantastic - never any probs - surely it makes economic sense for BRITISH local authorities to buy things made HERE!!! And yet loads are now using Scania and god knows what else.

Ask Joe Pubic and they will think that most British companies are now foreign owned - that Britain can't make anything decent - and that everything British breaks down all the time!

Britain leads the world in so many fields and British business owns more foreign companies than the rest of the world put together!
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Old 28 July 2004, 16:33   #46
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...or it could be because people like me (and I'm on my 12th Land Rover product) have to wait two weeks (Yes that's right TWO weeks) for a warranty repair. TWO weeks to fit two new half-shafts and drive flanges. It's not that I'm complaining about them failing, although you must admit that that in itself is fairly poor, but the fact that they could not get the parts for two weeks. The dealer, by the way, is only 4 miles from the factory and nearly as close to GKN!
And do you know what they (LandRover assistance) provided as a courteousy car? A Jaguar........

Just as well you didn't buy an Audi TT then - my mate had one just before it was discovered that the TT also had a lethal handling fault(german design again). His car was taken away for 3 MONTHS and he was given an A4 as a replacememnt - not a happy bunny!
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Old 28 July 2004, 16:43   #47
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............ Are you telling me that FIAT built wonderfull cars back in the 70s and 80s - or Citreon or Renault? Remember the 2cv and Renault 4? Remember the FIAT 126 and 124? And yet Italians and the French keep buying vast numbers of their cars!........
I passed my driving test in a Renault 4 , Examiner took one look at it and said if I could get it moving he'd pass me!! Pretty good off-road too, probably not with a RIB behind it though.......



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Old 28 July 2004, 17:03   #48
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[QUOTE=Windchill]
As for being a poor man's RR - BOLLOCKS!! I bough my wife's out of choice as I believe the engine particularly to be considerably better than anything RR have to offer. Didn't anybody see Top Gear when JC tested some big 4WDs in the mud? The Jeep outpaced the RR! Build isn't as good, but is is certainly good enough. If a car ever can be, I think it was good VFM - and there are deals to be had!

Actually I DO remember that Top Gear - the Land Rover Series I beat them all. To be honest slippery conditions are NOT a test of offroading - a Freelander is great in the slippery stuff but would be crap over rocks and boulders.

"Having said all this, I do fancy trying the new VW Touareg V10 diesel next!!"

WHY??? It has an awesome engine but it is too low for an offroader and too high for a sportscar!
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Old 28 July 2004, 17:11   #49
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Oh yes, I just thought of another good reason for buying a Defender; the panels come pre-distorted so it doesn't look so bad after a prang.

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Old 28 July 2004, 17:31   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codprawn
No I am on about the amazing ability of British people to run this country down at every possible opportunity for whatever reason they can find.

Are you telling me that FIAT built wonderfull cars back in the 70s and 80s - or Citreon or Renault? Remember the 2cv and Renault 4? Remember the FIAT 126 and 124? And yet Italians and the French keep buying vast numbers of their cars!

Yes, but the point is they got better. My Land Rover defender quality has deteriorated.. galvanized body cappings, Proper insulation between Carbon steel and Aluminium Etc....

Quote:
Originally Posted by codprawn
Dennis fire engines are fantastic - never any probs -

My Arse! As a one-time whole time fire fighter, I'm telling you that you are wrong. We had 'em off the run all the time...

...and take a good look round your house and business... how many of the products that you have brought are actually MADE in the UK?

It used to make me laugh to see "Keep Britain Farming" stickers on the back of farmer's Volvos, Mercs Etc...

Oh,By the way? I run a moderately successful engineering works that exports world-wide, but I don't wear blinkers...
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Old 28 July 2004, 17:36   #51
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Fuel To The Fire

I dont wish to come on here Landy bashing,I remember about 3 years ago in London I picked up a newspaper, read a survey
most unreliable car Freelander
second was disco
I have to be honest they look the part, are excellent off road, but its like having an affair, having a Landy,
you have to throw money at them all the time.
I know two people who owned a Landy Tim, had a Disco, it had gear selector fork problems, when quite new
I also know a guy who bought a Defender, the gearbox went on the drive home.Someone once said to me the reason Rover, is such bad quality, is because it is too unionised, you can imagne the dinner bell ringing in the car plant, and assembelers stopping mid way tro bolting compononts on for lunch, and starting on a new task after lunch, without finishing the old one.
They do look well Freelanders, Range Rovers ,Discos but thats were they stop, aluminium panels great idea, mechanically unreliable and troublesome.
The only tow vehicles, are jap ones, you dont have to buy new l200s just well looked after Patrols, bullet proof Troppers,Hiluxes and Pajeros for towing.
The Japs are years ahead of us with stuff like this, I have to admire the patroitics amongst us supporting local industry, but Jap stuff is the most reliable you will find, and big car makers know this, thats why we get so much scare stories about Grey imports and Jap stuff
Did anyone see the documentary with the HILUX mashed rolled, set alight and swamped in The Severn Estuary they drove it into the studio after,
Look what the Aussies drive Toyota off road
and the Taliban were they in Discos
no They only drive Jap stuff
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Old 28 July 2004, 18:08   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codprawn
Dennis fire engines are fantastic - never any probs - surely it makes economic sense for BRITISH local authorities to buy things made HERE!!! And yet loads are now using Scania and god knows what else.
dennis fire engies are not fantastic at all most british local authorities are
runing Vovlo Scania or Merc as tha are far better made to last longer and have top class service back up. we use a fire engine for dry riser testing so have had most type on the market. at what would be called end of service life
they get rid we buy and run them into the ground the best ones we have owned are merc and would you beleave this leyland no longer made now shame top class tender and lots for cheap part from dust carts

so for dennis were nice a long time ago now not on the same planet as the rest of the fire market

dan
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Old 28 July 2004, 18:14   #53
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Good point about the Toyotas - they now seem to be the weapon of choice if you life depends upon your vehicle.

The interesting thing about the Toyota Hi Lux that Top Gear tried to kill was its age. A mate of mine sells Toyotas & told me that a brand new version would have died when it got the soaking, due to the modern electronic systems fitted to the vehicle.

The Japanese vehicles do seem to lack "soul" though. My Subaru Imprezza WRX wagon is incredibly fast & secure & (it goes without saying) reliable, but after nearly 3 years of ownership I still can't say that I actually like it..

Come replacement time I will probably get a Land Rover. Why? Because I have always wanted one since I was a kid. Thats why. Where's the logic in that? No where at all, but who said buying a car was a rational thing?
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Old 28 July 2004, 18:21   #54
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No I am on about the amazing ability of British people to run this country down at every possible opportunity for whatever reason they can find.
I hardly think a few ribsters relating tales of their's and their friends' unreliable Land Rovers constitutes any form of high treason quite frankly.

I must admit I do find the propensity for exaggeration and sweeping generalisations in many of your posts faintly amusing,
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Old 28 July 2004, 18:24   #55
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.......Look what the Aussies drive Toyota off road...
... but not the same spec as we get...and they do drive LR's, at least my relatives do, but they stick Holden engines in 'em and home grown drive-train parts.....
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Old 28 July 2004, 20:17   #56
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Thanks Guys!

Thank you all for your honest appraisal of the Jeep and its main competitors.

From what you have said, it seems that there are no obvious drawbacks to the Jeep, except for the cost of spare parts. But it doesn't look like I shall be needing too many of these, if reliability is as good as some of you have suggested.

Compared to the spares on my last boat (which ran a 5.7 litre V8 Volvo petrol inboard) I think ANY car will appear cheap to run!

Unfortunately, I have to admit that the Jeep will seriously dent my budget for the boat, which I hope to order in the latter part of next year for April 2006.

However (and Codprawn should be proud of me for this) I will buy a BRITISH boat! Barring a major financial disaster, I shall order an 8.5 Scorpion with Shhhh ... a 275 Verado - oops, wrong side of the Atlantic. It might be a bit light on electronics for a while - that's all!

BTW, I intend to keep the boat and the car for perhaps 20 years - I had my last boat for 14 years (from new) and I tend to get attached to things!

Regards,

Chris.
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Old 28 July 2004, 20:47   #57
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Had to sit a listen to someone going off on one big time on his mobile phone to his garage, while having breakfast in a café this morning. From his shouting it was clear to know he was having problems with his Landy Freeloader, the Auto gearbox is knackered after only 25,000 miles.
Now I have seen all the comments on this forum it would appear that LR should pull their act together before people start deserting the old workhorse for something else.
I have always fancied getting a LR but after today I don’t think I’ll bother.
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Old 28 July 2004, 20:51   #58
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....but after nearly 3 years of ownership I still can't say that I actually like it..
That's where the Jeep scores, it really is a nice thing to be inside of. And, my wife loves it, which is no small consideration.
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Old 28 July 2004, 21:21   #59
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For what its worth.....I have owned two L/R 110's between them they have covered 1/4 million miles. I broke down once in the first one when the throttle cable broke.They are built like BSH's far tougher than Jeeps etc...just get under a defender and have a look at the Chassis, running gear etc...there is no better tow vehicle..nothing better off road (I once was taken around LR's test track that included 1 in1 hills, concrete stairs a river section a sideways slope at 43 degrees etc. with 10 members of the public and a driver in it) then of course there was the Camel trophy. my current one has traction control, abs and aircon it very comfortable (towed the boat from scotland to home in one day over 650 miles and felt fine when i got home) It does 26-27 mpg never needs oil between services (12000 miles) has a full length roofrack that doubles as a private grandstand and weekend accomodation in the roof tent. Just replaced the tyres after 90 thousand miles 450.00 the full set. seats up to 12 people...........and they look great too
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Old 28 July 2004, 21:23   #60
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Well I will continue to drive my old 110 V8 ex police which had a hard life even before I bought it - of all the cars I have had lately - far more than most - it is the only one I know will never let me down.

I have had probs with the following

Audi A4
VW Golf
VW Passat
Merc something or other
Vectra
Signum
Pug 406

They have all had their faults!

Oh one other thing - the Land Rover is FUN - something nobody who likes any of the above cars would even begin to understand!
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