Driving skills (was Driving in fog)

[Richard B]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

There are a few good reasons we tailgate

I'm sorry Nos, did I hear you correctly? You're trying to justify tailgating? By 40 tonne vehicles? And just a few posts ago you were lecturing me on the dangers of not leaving enough gap?

And if you're offering Louise some practical advice, I'll turn it down on her behalf... not just because you suggested it in a patronising manner, but because I don't see you presenting any evidence that you're one of the better professional HGV drivers, and I would like to make sure that my little boy has a mother for a long time.

Here's an archive picture of one of your "professional" colleagues endangering my (and others) life in 50mph zone on a motorway...

[Jimbo]

Originally Posted by Richard B

Here's an archive picture of one of your "professional" colleagues endangering my (and others) life in 50mph zone on a motorway...

Nice photo - do you have a camera mounted on your rearview or something? Could come in handy I guess.

[Biggles]

Thats such a good photo looks almost as if your in a traffic jam !!!

[Biggles]

And why are there so many lorries on our roads anyway. They keep saying they are finding it hard to make a living, due to fuel price rises, but there doesn't seem to get any less of them.

I used to check vehicle loads and was suprised to find many HGV's (Around the 7.5 ton mark, so possibly not quite HGV's but big anyway) carrying small parcels that could be carried in a small car. And this wasn't a lot of small parcels but just one !

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Biggles

And why are there so many lorries on our roads anyway. They keep saying they are finding it hard to make a living, due to fuel price rises, but there doesn't seem to get any less of them.

Your house arrived (in pieces) on a truck.
Your car arrived on a truck.
Your food arrived at the supermarket in a truck.
The fuel that's running the power station that produces the power for you to read this arrived by truck.
The component parts for your entire life has been moved by trucks.

Without them we'll all freeze and starve in the dark.

The reason that it's hard to make a living is because people see transport as an unnecessary cost and everyone is trying to undercut everyone else. With average profits at around 5% it takes very little to send a small/medium size transport company bankrupt.

[bogib]

Little bit off topic.... but could be related though as we are more used to drive in blizzard with almost zero visability and icy/snowy slippery roads

Picked up some blow off piccies from our morning paper...

Not foggy pictures more like icy roads and nasty winds

Bogi

[Biggles]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

Your house arrived (in pieces) on a truck.

I think it was arriving brick by brick in the trucks I checked.

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Richard B

I'm sorry Nos, did I hear you correctly? You're trying to justify tailgating? By 40 tonne vehicles? And just a few posts ago you were lecturing me on the dangers of not leaving enough gap?

And if you're offering Louise some practical advice, I'll turn it down on her behalf... not just because you suggested it in a patronising manner, but because I don't see you presenting any evidence that you're one of the better professional HGV drivers, and I would like to make sure that my little boy has a mother for a long time.

Here's an archive picture of one of your "professional" colleagues endangering my (and others) life in 50mph zone on a motorway...

I see. One drives badly so all do it, yeah?(It's a Renault so probably a French driver by the way. Hardly any British companies use new Magnums.)

Taking a picture while driving? My, how good you must feel for being such a selfless road captain. How clever of you not to be looking where you're going when the 50 limit is there to PROTECT THE PEOPLE WORKING ALONGSIDE WHERE YOU'RE DRIVING.

I unfortunately have to work in a world full of clueless self-righteous pratts like you. The majority of the time anything happens I have no choice but the 'least worst' option due to the shortsightedness and lack of any form of clue let alone forward planning of the incompetent muppets driving cars.I don't like being put in that situation but it's a reality of the job.

Closing up a gap is unfortunately one of the 'least worst' options. You've got a fair idea what the truck in front is going to do and a bloody good idea that the car driving along looking at the end of their bonnet who thinks mirrors are for make-up is going to do something unpredictable and stupid.

Toby's right-you'll never understand. You'll continue to be a self-righteous road captain in a car and a danger to all that surround you.

I think Louise can refuse for herself BTW-I'm sure she has a voice of her own-or you can come instead. It might open your eyes a little. What I'd call a near miss you wouldn't even realise had happened...

<edit> Almost</edit>My last word on the subject. It's getting boring failing to educate the suicidal.

I don't have the gall to tell you how to do your job. Don't presume to have the first clue about mine.

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Biggles

I think it was arriving brick by brick in the trucks I checked.

What time of day?

[Biggles]

As for closing the gap.

This happens to everybody. Follow the 2 second rule and you'll have enough space to stop say the authorities. Unfortunately follow the 2 second rule on a UK Motorway and you'll get an idiot pulling in front of you.

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Biggles

As for closing the gap.

This happens to everybody. Follow the 2 second rule and you'll have enough space to stop say the authorities. Unfortunately follow the 2 second rule on a UK Motorway and you'll get an idiot pulling in front of you.

Too true

To put it in my perspective it's 100 times worse when you can take 1/3 mile to stop from 56mph-and significantly longer if on a downhill stretch. They don't get a bump if we hit them either-more than likely a bodybag

[Biggles]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

Too true

To put it in my perspective it's 100 times worse when you can take 1/3 mile to stop from 56mph-and significantly longer if on a downhill stretch. They don't get a bump if we hit them either-more than likely a bodybag

So whats the problem. None as far as I can see. You wipe out an idiot, the UK is a more civilised place, and you get off scott free becuase said idiot did an idiot thing. Everyones happy, even the idiot because being an idiot he/she didn't know any better. Thats why they are an idiot.

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Biggles

So whats the problem. None as far as I can see. You wipe out an idiot, the UK is a more civilised place, and you get off scott free becuase said idiot did an idiot thing. Everyones happy, even the idiot because being an idiot he/she didn't know any better. Thats why they are an idiot.

I wish it was that simple...

A former workmate ran over and killed an old man in 2001 in Bristol. It wasn't his fault-the guy fell under the back axle of his truck from the path as he passed him.
The truck was impounded by the Ministry of Transport and inspected,driver questioned, witnesses questioned and 3 months later the guy was still waking up screaming and couldn't work because of what happened and what he saw.

That's one of the reasons I'm looking for a way out.

[Richard B]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

I don't have the gall to tell you how to do your job. Don't presume to have the first clue about mine.

Don't be so naive Nos. Your actions at work have a direct impact on other road users. If your actions on the road are unacceptable to other road users, you need to take notice. You also have a legal responsibility to carry out your job safely as you do it on license, and if you don't then that license can be removed. As for telling me how to do may job... please do! I'm broad minded and never turn down free information.

Sure, have a go at me for waving my phone in the air for about a second last year... it's no big deal compared to this tailgating that you're advocating by a different name.

So... this "closing the gap"... do you think that fourteen lorries "closing the gap" so that traffic can't leave at their exit is acceptable? In heavy rain as well? Happened to me on the M6 last year, and I couldn't even read the signs (neither could my passenger) for the M56 exit. We continued to the next exit and did a detour. Thanks for that, "professional truckers".

And you reckon this "closing the gap" technique is "one of the 'least worst' options"? Is this an officially recognised technique? Is it endorsed by the police? The Road Haulage Association? It certainly isn't endorsed by the MD of Somerfield who asked for an explanation from eight of his drivers who tailgated each other down the M5 a few years back.

You need to take a long hard look in the mirror and have a good think about who's being self-righteous here.

[MikeCC]

I don't understand why driving in fog is so tricky.

1. If you can't see where you're going slow down until you can (and if that pisses off the person 2 feet behind you, stop, let them overtake and see how they like the look of it)
2. If you can see a car behind you, you don't need your rear fog lamps on (unless it's foggy mate innit)
3. If you can see a car in front of you, you don't need your front fog lamps on (unless it's dark mate innit)
4. If the high-intensity lights in front of you are too bright, just rear-end them at the next roundabout/junction etc and say that you were blinded by their fog lamps. (Especially good tactic if you have an old sh*tter you want to write off - fully comp, protected NCB recommended for this approach)
5. Er. . . have some consideration for other road users (or is that too nice?)

The biggest problem is that some drivers are just too f***ing lazy to turn the lights on and off as conditions/traffic change. Not much different to driving round with full beam all the time.

Amazingly, I did see a local patrol car stop someone outside our house the other day (in completely clear conditions) AND -SHOCK- GET THEM TO TURN THEIR FRONT FOGS OFF! So Mr Plod (or some at least) do find it as annoying as the rest of us.

Re the truck discussion - well, some are cretinous tailgaters and others are not. I've had lifts in trucks with the driver making a roll-up with us 20 feet from the one in front at 60mph+ - needless to say I learned v quickly to make decent roll-ups! But Nos, many many drivers just don't get the basic physics of it when you're starting/stopping/overtaking.

[Hightower]

Originally Posted by Richard B

Sure, have a go at me for waving my phone in the air for about a second last year... it's no big deal compared to this tailgating that you're advocating by a different name.

To be honest, I think they're both as bad as each other. My Son nearly got mowed down by a motorist using his mobile, if I'd caught him I'd have put it somewhere where the Sun don't shine.

[osprey__viper]

Originally Posted by Richard B

Don't be so naive Nos. Your actions at work have a direct impact on other road users. If your actions on the road are unacceptable to other road users, you need to take notice. You also have a legal responsibility to carry out your job safely as you do it on license, and if you don't then that license can be removed. As for telling me how to do may job... please do! I'm broad minded and never turn down free information.

Sure, have a go at me for waving my phone in the air for about a second last year... it's no big deal compared to this tailgating that you're advocating by a different name.

So... this "closing the gap"... do you think that fourteen lorries "closing the gap" so that traffic can't leave at their exit is acceptable? In heavy rain as well? Happened to me on the M6 last year, and I couldn't even read the signs (neither could my passenger) for the M56 exit. We continued to the next exit and did a detour. Thanks for that, "professional truckers".

And you reckon this "closing the gap" technique is "one of the 'least worst' options"? Is this an officially recognised technique? Is it endorsed by the police? The Road Haulage Association? It certainly isn't endorsed by the MD of Somerfield who asked for an explanation from eight of his drivers who tailgated each other down the M5 a few years back.

You need to take a long hard look in the mirror and have a good think about who's being self-righteous here.

Hmmmm, reading the thread with interest. I gave up full time lorry driving earlier this year when I manged to be part of the M1 being closed for 15mins at peak rush hour. That accident was the iceing on the cake due to a pillock of a car driver who hadn't got road sense or forward planning and had the same attitude as you. Take up Nos on his offer and see the world from our perspective. If not get down off your moral high horse. The 'other driver' still has there job and life, me, well im scratching around trying to make a new career. Nice to see you have a broad minded opinion (not).

From one EX trucker to a current one, keep up the good work Nos. I for one appreciate ya

[Hightower]

I've never driven a truck but am aware of it's weight and size and presence on the road. When trucks indicate to pull out to overtake on a hill, I let them as I know what dificulties they have on our roads. I also flash to indicate when a lorry is clear to move back in (dosen't happen very often ). It's a tough life being a lorry driver and yes there are bad ones (hopefully not too many) but there are bad car drivers (and many more so as there are more cars than lorrys) as well, it's a fact of life! So next time either one of you guys comes up to the other on the road, be curtious (which I'm sure you both are).

And slightly off topic, I did see a RIBber (which will remain nameless) drive in front of a container ship that was navigating Southampton water, too close. He was stopped by the Pilot boat and given a bollocking. So a little similar to a car that pulls in front of a lorry on a motorway.

[Nos4r2]

Originally Posted by Richard B

So... this "closing the gap"... do you think that fourteen lorries "closing the gap" so that traffic can't leave at their exit is acceptable? In heavy rain as well? Happened to me on the M6 last year, and I couldn't even read the signs (neither could my passenger) for the M56 exit. We continued to the next exit and did a detour.

No, you're right. It's not acceptable. It's also not what I described. There are basic advanced driving techniques that should have avoided that though.
Unless 14 lorries=1 mile long though then you should have seen the road signs though-unless of course you were driving too fast in heavy rain and bad visibility.

Originally Posted by Richard B

And you reckon this "closing the gap" technique is "one of the 'least worst' options"? Is this an officially recognised technique? Is it endorsed by the police? The Road Haulage Association? It certainly isn't endorsed by the MD of Somerfield who asked for an explanation from eight of his drivers who tailgated each other down the M5 a few years back.

You need to take a long hard look in the mirror and have a good think about who's being self-righteous here.

Actually, yes. Taking command of the road is taught as part of the HGV driving test-though so is keeping a safe gap,which is impossible to do with a numpty trying to join the motorway 5 feet ahead of us. Least worst option.
On occasion we have to take the 'least worst option' because EVEN THOUGH we expect everyone else to be driving like a complete muppet SOMETIMES they manage to do something so bloody stupid that it's the only way that's possible to react. I'm sure attempting not to be in collision with people who do extremely stupid things is endorsed by both the RHA and the Police.

I'm not talking about constant tailgating here. I'm talking about closing up a gap for maybe 20 seconds for my own safety so that anything stupid the potential idiot does happens behind me.
You learn to recognise which car is going to do something stupid-usually because they are driving along just ahead of the trailer wheels and are sitting at a steady speed instead of making a decisive move towards a gap to merge onto the motorway-or they are screaming up the inside desperately trying to get a few feet further. Bad drivers stand out. Good ones don't.

The MD of Somerfield? Does being the MD automatically make him a truck driver or qualify him to have an opinion?

I look in my mirrors to see what's behind me...

[Richard B]

Originally Posted by osprey__viper

a car driver who... had the same attitude as you.

Same attitude as me? How do you judge and know that?

Originally Posted by osprey__viper

Take up Nos on his offer and see the world from our perspective.

Been there, seen it and done it. Not with Nos, but with many other HGV drivers in the past. Have driven a Volvo FL7 on private roads. Bedford seven-and-a-half tonner on the roads and in my late teens worked for an agricultural contractor towing 40' trailers with a Massey Ferguson or Ford 7700. And they only have drum brakes on the rear wheels. Scary downhill, if you're not in gear in advance, the consequences don't bear thinking about.

So you're advocating this tailgating, aka "closing the gap"?