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Old 06 August 2013, 04:20   #81
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FFS!! anyone considering taking up Ribbing & then baulking at shelling out 70 quid for what could be a lifesaver, should seriously consider another hobby, basket weaving or embroidery spring to mind. It's not the money, it's the mind set that's in question here.
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Old 06 August 2013, 04:30   #82
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FFS!! anyone considering taking up Ribbing & then baulking at shelling out 70 quid for what could be a lifesaver, should seriously consider another hobby, basket weaving or embroidery spring to mind. It's not the money, it's the mind set that's in question here.
The point is that you do not need to spend 70 for it to be a life saver! Everyone knows the basics of requesting assistance having referred to the simple paragraph illustrated in all guides. And for those whom really do struggle, the person on the other end of the VHF whom responds (the coastguard etc) is trained to ask the right questions.

Strikes me that this VHF license is a little like the electrical Part-P, a career-tax for information which really is logical if you take the time to look at the basics.

And lets not also forget - emergencies should be rare and very infrequent, if at all - by the time that moment arises, who is to say that what you studied on the course (perhaps years ago) is even going to be in memory?
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Old 06 August 2013, 04:35   #83
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The point is that you do not need to spend 70 for it to be a life saver! Everyone knows the basics of requesting assistance having referred to the simple paragraph illustrated in all guides. And for those whom really do struggle, the person on the other end of the VHF whom responds (the coastguard etc) is trained to ask the right questions.

Strikes me that this VHF license is a little like the electrical Part-P, a career-tax!
Part of me agrees. It's not tricky to make a reasonably competent chef distress call. BUT are you sure you are doing the best you can if you've never been trained, never practiced, and never had feedback - most people speak far too fast for someone to understand the whole message. Whilst you also believe it is dead easy there are some quirks of dsc which are not intuitive and that some novices on my course really struggled with.
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Old 06 August 2013, 04:43   #84
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Pikey (with reference to your rules #2 and #3), Poly, we're all
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Old 06 August 2013, 04:45   #85
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Part of me agrees. It's not tricky to make a reasonably competent chef distress call. BUT are you sure you are doing the best you can if you've never been trained, never practiced, and never had feedback - most people speak far too fast for someone to understand the whole message. Whilst you also believe it is dead easy there are some quirks of dsc which are not intuitive and that some novices on my course really struggled with.
I have had trained plumbers that did an awful job, I had NVQ certified builders that built a wall which bows and leans, I have had a boiler fitted by a qualified GasSafe engineer fitted in the wrong place despite clear direction, and a new roof constructed by qualified roofers using inadequately sized wooden supports (a later discovery). I am also a qualified Rescue Scuba Diver, and have dived with Divemasters (a higher qualification) whom could barely control their own buoyancy whilst underwater.

Qualifications, training, certifications do not make you a more competent person, your own person makes you a competent person...or not.

Despite VHF training, someone that has done the course can still panic, give incorrect information, talk too fast or simply have forgotten the contents of a course that they took years ago.

...and Max, a difference of opinion doesn't make you an idiot, it simply means a difference of opinion from your own.
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Old 06 August 2013, 05:12   #86
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Qualifications, training, certifications do not make you a more competent person, your own person makes you a competent person...or not.
???

Interesting. I suppose you prefer a self-taught dentist to look after your teeth.

Guessing you learnt to dive by trial and error too, sod all that teaching lark.

Training - pah! Useless old idea.
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Old 06 August 2013, 05:20   #87
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???

Interesting. I suppose you prefer a self-taught dentist to look after your teeth.

Guessing you learnt to dive by trial and error too, sod all that teaching lark.

Training - pah! Useless old idea.
No, I trained fully and properly in Scuba as it is a dangerous hobby which can genuinely end your life and the life of your buddy in an instant. There are good and bad dentists, despite training.

Lets not forget, we're talking about simply using a radio here to ask for help in hopefully a rare emergency situation. Actually I would only use mine in such a situation, as mentioned earlier. If I take to the sea more often, then perhaps I will consider taking the course, especially if by that time I have a DSC set.

Chill a little Max, everyone has an opinion, that is the purpose of a forum - there is absolutely no need to get personal.
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Old 06 August 2013, 05:55   #88
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Not getting personal fellow and I'm very chilled thanks.

Merely disagreeing (or expressing an opinion) with a blanket statement like:

"Qualifications, training, certifications do not make you a more competent person, your own person makes you a competent person...or not".

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No, I trained fully and properly in Scuba as it is a dangerous hobby which can genuinely end your life and the life of your buddy in an instant. There are good and bad dentists, despite training.
Many would consider that setting out to sea in a little rubber boat is indeed a "...dangerous hobby which can genuinely end your life".

TBH though if you look back at my posts in this topic I'm referring more to the idea that doing *PB2* is a great idea for a complete boating novice rather than your attitude to benefits of the legally required VHF course.

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Old 06 August 2013, 05:58   #89
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Not getting personal fellow and I'm very chilled thanks.

Merely disagreeing (or expressing an opinion) with a blanket statement like:

"Qualifications, training, certifications do not make you a more competent person, your own person makes you a competent person...or not".

Then you misinterpreted my statement. To clarify, I am not stating that you need not train formally to be a good doctor, dentist or in any other profession/hobby, I am simply stating that a fully qualified doctor/dentist/VHF operator is not necessarily a competent person.

Anyway...thanks everyone for their responses concerning my seeking a VHF unit.
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Old 06 August 2013, 06:02   #90
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So do you all still think I am barking up the wrong tree when I suggest that manditory training and certification should be enforced????

After all there are a lot of comments suggesting that the VHF course is a very good idea, which by the way, is a form of manditory training

However I do have some sympathy with some of the comments, particularly if the person is only going to be using inland rivers, and canals, but as soon as they were to venture onto the tidal stretches of the rivers, or any body of water where a HM, or port authority has control of, he should have and be able to use the VHF, which he cannot (should not) do if he does not have a licence.

If you are not able to use the VHF then how do you carry out a radio check, maybe the answers on the internet, or the download cards??

How do you report to the HM, (as some places require) for entering port/crossing channels without your VHF, again something probably not covered on the internet?

The difference is that with a VHF licence you can practice using it, get confidence in using the equipment, so that in case of an emergency you are less likely to forget things.

This is a completly different kettle of fish from building a roof wrongly, installing plumbing wrongly, building a wall poorly, or the other examples given, as they were (most likely) not done with the persons life in danger throughout the whole process in a time of great personal stress.

Just as diving, boating has inherent dangers, just look at the MCA for statistics on the number of people killed each year in lesiure craft, 9 or 10 a year, and tell me it is not. Many more are injured, and rescued, and need assistance, which in a lot of cases is facilitated by VHF comms, hence the need to train, learn properly and PRATICE to get EXPERIENCE
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