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Old 05 October 2010, 11:45   #11
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You can test for power with a test lead (a couple of cables attached to a bulb) or a multimeter, set to DC Volts. when the motor was last de-commissioned, if the main battery lead was removed from the starter solenoid, then the red lead which feeds 12v+ to the trim motor relays may have also been detached at his point and when the main battery lead was recently re-connected, perhaps the red lead to the relays was not similarly re-connected to the same terminal?
The feed from the PTT switch(es) will energise the relays, but if there's no heavy duty supply from the battery, then there's nothing to power the trim motor.

Hope that makes sense?
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Old 05 October 2010, 14:23   #12
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Does the trim not work on either the throtle control trim switch or the local trim switch on the engine? Im not sure if you have tried both?

I ask because the local switch on my twatsooo engine packed in and needed a strip down and clean earlier this year.
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Old 05 October 2010, 17:59   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Downhilldai View Post
You can test for power with a test lead (a couple of cables attached to a bulb) or a multimeter, set to DC Volts. when the motor was last de-commissioned, if the main battery lead was removed from the starter solenoid, then the red lead which feeds 12v+ to the trim motor relays may have also been detached at his point and when the main battery lead was recently re-connected, perhaps the red lead to the relays was not similarly re-connected to the same terminal?
The feed from the PTT switch(es) will energise the relays, but if there's no heavy duty supply from the battery, then there's nothing to power the trim motor.

Hope that makes sense?
Tested this again tonight. Both PTT 'up' and 'down' relays click which suggest they are operating and not the root cause. When the engine was last used, the remote control was disconnected. All other wiring was intact (and the trim had been working prior to transit). Checked the in-line fuse again and it's fine.

I need to test the PTT motor itself. Found this online:
Quote:
To test the motor itself, bypassing the relays and relay wiring, find the two heavy gauge wires that lead to the trim/tilt pump motor. One should be green and the other blue. You will probably be able to find a quick disconnect plug near where the wires exit the outboard engine cover that you can disconnect. Ground one wire to any metal surface and provide +12 volts from the battery to the other. The motor should run in one direction or the other. Now reverse the wires and the motor should run in the other direction. This will at least tell you if the motor is operating, so that you will have a better idea of what the actual problem might be.
Assuming I've interpreted this properly, I attached a jump wire to the green wire and ground it to a metal surface. I then applied the blue wire to the (+) terminal on the 12v battery. Nothing. Tried switching the wires. Again, nothing. Have I done this right? Is the motor faulty? The engine itself is immaculate. I just can't see that the motor has failed. Are they servicible items, or sealed units?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yoyo
Does the trim not work on either the throttle control trim switch or the local trim switch on the engine? I'm not sure if you have tried both?
Pretty sure it's not the switch on the engine or the remote. Both work and get a 'click' noise in the up or down position. Thanks for the suggestion though.
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Old 05 October 2010, 18:21   #14
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Originally Posted by spartacus View Post
Assuming I've interpreted this properly, I attached a jump wire to the green wire and ground it to a metal surface. I then applied the blue wire to the (+) terminal on the 12v battery. Nothing. Tried switching the wires. Again, nothing. Have I done this right? Is the motor faulty? The engine itself is immaculate. I just can't see that the motor has failed. Are they servicible items, or sealed units?
Coming to the conclusion that the motor is at fault means you are making the following assumptions:

(1) the battery definitely has enough juice. if I follow correctly it was at 12.3V a few weeks ago, since then you've been trying to turn it over presumably depleting it further.

(2) the ground connection between the battery and engine is good. given your problems come after rerigging the engine I'd not jump to that conclusion.

I'd be inclined to put a multimeter directly on the battery and read the voltage with everything off. Then the voltage at the battery when the PTT switch is depressed (if it drops then there is "juice" going somewhere. Then measure the voltage just before the ptt relay (big red wire?) back to a good earth point on the engine (it should be virtually identical to the voltage at the engine). Now measure the voltage at the motor (those green/blue wires). When you press the PTT switch that should be the same as it was at the battery with the PTT depressed (or very close).

If I wanted to test the motor specifically I'd use a different known good battery connected directly with short leads (e.g. a jump start pack).
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Old 05 October 2010, 18:39   #15
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I believe your online instructions are wrong.

Did you test the red cable on both relays to check if there's 12v +ve there?

Another check for you:
Disconnect the green cable from the down relay and take this direct to the terminal for the heavy red cable (running from the battery) on the starter solenoid. The motor should go down.
If this works ok, try the same for the blue cable to check if it goes up.
If both tests result in the PTT working, then there's a problem between the battery (starter solenoid) and the trim relays.....

If it doesn't work, then as Polly says, check the -ve connections between the battery, the powerhead and the trim motor.
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Old 05 October 2010, 18:42   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polwart View Post
Coming to the conclusion that the motor is at fault means you are making the following assumptions:

(1) the battery definitely has enough juice. if I follow correctly it was at 12.3V a few weeks ago, since then you've been trying to turn it over presumably depleting it further.

(2) the ground connection between the battery and engine is good. given your problems come after rerigging the engine I'd not jump to that conclusion.

I'd be inclined to put a multimeter directly on the battery and read the voltage with everything off. Then the voltage at the battery when the PTT switch is depressed (if it drops then there is "juice" going somewhere. Then measure the voltage just before the ptt relay (big red wire?) back to a good earth point on the engine (it should be virtually identical to the voltage at the engine). Now measure the voltage at the motor (those green/blue wires). When you press the PTT switch that should be the same as it was at the battery with the PTT depressed (or very close).

If I wanted to test the motor specifically I'd use a different known good battery connected directly with short leads (e.g. a jump start pack).
Only tried to start the engine on Sunday. No lack of power to get the starter motor going. Prior to this the battery had been on a trickle charge for a few hours each weekend. I got the battery tested on a digital multimeter at a local garage. They said it was 85% efficient and measured 12.3v. Back on a trickle charge just now. Think I need to invest in a multimeter!

I only tried it for a few attempts on Sunday and have concluded that there was no choke applied, or the warm lever was in the upright position. I'm sure she'll fire up okay, but started tinkering and removed the thermostat for a closer inspection, hence I now need a gasket and can't follow this up until I've refitted it.

Back to the tilt and trim. I'll get a multimeter and do some readings. Thanks for the help.
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Old 05 October 2010, 18:47   #17
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Only tried to start the engine on Sunday. No lack of power to get the starter motor going. Prior to this the battery had been on a trickle charge for a few hours each weekend. I got the battery tested on a digital multimeter at a local garage. They said it was 85% efficient and measured 12.3v. Back on a trickle charge just now. Think I need to invest in a multimeter!

I only tried it for a few attempts on Sunday and have concluded that there was no choke applied, or the warm lever was in the upright position. I'm sure she'll fire up okay, but started tinkering and removed the thermostat for a closer inspection, hence I now need a gasket and can't follow this up until I've refitted it.

Back to the tilt and trim. I'll get a multimeter and do some readings. Thanks for the help.
Ah - hadn't realised that you were working blind without a multimeter. they cost about a fiver for a cheap one and I think are almost essential for boat diagnostics! You could do some of DHD's tests without one though.

12.3 V doesn't sound great to me for a battery which has been on charge for a while? it sounds about what mine will be after sitting for 3 months. A week after a good run, it would be at 12.7 V.
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Old 05 October 2010, 18:58   #18
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Originally Posted by Downhilldai View Post
I believe your online instructions are wrong.

Did you test the red cable on both relays to check if there's 12v +ve there?

Another check for you:
Disconnect the green cable from the down relay and take this direct to the terminal for the heavy red cable (running from the battery) on the starter solenoid. The motor should go down.
If this works ok, try the same for the blue cable to check if it goes up.
If both tests result in the PTT working, then there's a problem between the battery (starter solenoid) and the trim relays.....

If it doesn't work, then as Polly says, check the -ve connections between the battery, the powerhead and the trim motor.
This is like talking down a 747 with me at the controls... "can you see a red flashing light above you with the words 'warning' on it?"

Seriously though. Just reconnected the battery terminals and put the blue cable back on to the relay and placed the green one onto the starter solenoid. Nothing.

Yes the battery is probably due for replacement. Will get a multimeter tomorrow night at Halfrauds and take if from there. I hate bleed'n electrics.
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Old 05 October 2010, 19:14   #19
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Just reconnected the battery terminals and put the blue cable back on to the relay and placed the green one onto the starter solenoid. Nothing.
In that case, suggest you look for:

1. Flat battery - unlikely, given the recent test on it.

2. Defective wiring between relays and trim motor - unlikely, as it won't go up or down.

2. Defective trim motor - unlikely, given it was working when you de-commissioned the motor and it's been living indoors since. But, it could be 'stuck' in position.

3. Dodgy earth (12v -ve) connection somewhere between the trim motor and the battery. Leave the green cable on the heavy gauge Red cable and if you have one, try connecting a separate cable from the body of the PTT motor, direct to the battery -ve terminal, or to the -ve connection for the main battery cable on the powerhead.
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Old 06 October 2010, 09:11   #20
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If youre going to Halfords to buy a meter, the test becomes relatively easy:

Disconnect the motor at the quick connector. Put the two probes into the supply side of the connector, and hit the up or down switch. One should give +12(ish) the other -12(ish).

If you haven't already bought it, a simple digital meter would be best, as an analouge one will try to go backwards off the scale if connected with the + probe on the -ve side. A digi one will just put a "-" in front of the digits & carry on.
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