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Old 22 August 2015, 15:08   #21
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I respectfully disagree completely with the "old is dead" idea. Alloy steel is not hypalon or a car's brake line. Steel WEARS out and is not appreciably affected by exposure to air, especially when oiled. There are a few old cars on the road today because of that. Dump trucks routinely run in excess of 500,000 miles. Guys pushed dozers off into the brush when they built the ALCAN, then came back 20 yrs later and fired them up... if they remembered where they were. Etc. This is not a case of rotting; it is a case where a defective engine failed because parts were poorly engineered and severe wear happened prematurely. Age is immaterial. P, EOS. BTW: I had a Subaru that was one of the 2000-2006 (?) machines with a head gasket problem. Subaru admitted the problem immediately and extended the warranty for several years. Mine blew after 11 yrs and 90,000 miles; that is understandable and I had it repaired w/out complaint. It is of interest, too, that my hypalon is in EXCELLENT condition still. And finally, my reference to "break in period" was hyperbole; roger, it is more like 10 hrs like most engines. I'm not stupid..... well, not REAL stupid, but I DO have my days! cheers. john
No manufacturer will warrant a 10 y/o engine, that would just be insane. !
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Old 22 August 2015, 15:10   #22
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Personally once out of warranty I wouldn't even consider moaning about something breaking.

Most boats I see for sale with etech engine have a list of warranty repairs undertaken and without getting into an etech bashing thread it puts me off personally wanting one as I could only afford an older one with potentially no warranty so what would I do if it breaks and seems to be something they replace under warranty regularly. I doubt going to brp saying its looks like a know fault will get it repaired as they will just say out of warranty.

My Bayliner is 19 years old and only done the same hours your engine has done. If I blow it up I doubt mercruiser would even consider listening to me
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Old 22 August 2015, 16:55   #23
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My Bayliner is 19 years old and only done the same hours your engine has done. If I blow it up I doubt mercruiser would even consider listening to me
Depending on a thing called "honor". Warranty should reflect quality during use, not some artificially imposed deadline. And, btw, I assume that the "3-yr" deal takes into account average usage and is therefore a convenient, and generally reasonable, metric. But the question is, Why not warranty something to LAST DURING USAGE, not sitting on the shelf? Aren't we supposed to actually use the stuff we buy in good faith, and expect to get hours and hours of use out of it? Why do we only expect things to be of quality for X number of years? MHO: Because we have been conditioned to it, not because of any physical reason, necessarily. It's our throw-away society mentality, which has been forced on us by some industries. The idea that one rule fits all is rarely the best policy, but it is convenient and generally OK. We can extend that silly "one rule" logic to most anything and any group of people. A brain needs to intercede in certain cases. Craftsman, for example, warranties their hand tools forever, n.q.a. If you break a socket or ratchet, you take it to Sears and are handed a new one. I realize that a socket is only a few $$ (or pounds), but the number returned adds up to one H of a lot of money. That, my friends, is honor. Now, I need to take my FIFTEEN horse Honda, trusty little sucker it is, and go fishing. cheers. john
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Old 22 August 2015, 17:16   #24
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This is a very interesting thread that I am following closely
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Old 22 August 2015, 18:12   #25
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Craftsman, for example, warranties their hand tools forever, n.q.a. If you break a socket or ratchet, you take it to Sears and are handed a new one. I realize that a socket is only a few $$ (or pounds), but the number returned adds up to one H of a lot of money. That, my friends, is honor.
Naw. That's not honour its called clever marketing... Because 80% of customers will never claim and the actual part is cheap as chips. But they won't replace the stud that it damaged by being worn. So honda can replace the washer. But don't expect them to rebuild the engine.

As for a 90k Subaru 11year old head gasket - plenty of vehicles have failed a head at 11yrs or 90k. Poor Honda now needs to live up to your excessive expectations caused by Subaru.

On the comparison to the Dump Trucks I recently bought a seagul engine that was built in 1973 and had been garaged for probably 20 years. Bought untested. Ran it up in a tank and after fixing a leaky fuel washer and cleaning the points it started second pull. Good old engineering. Maybe ... ... But the tilt bracket has since broken, and the HT lead crumbled to pieces. Started fine though on first try, but needs some work to make me feel she is OK. Now should I go see British Seagul about a warranty claim on the tilt bracket - I've heard of some other people who broke theirs and i've heard dealers don't sell them anymore... ...all favouring these Japanese designs. Suspect it's done less hours than your Honda.
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Old 22 August 2015, 18:13   #26
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Based on what you have said I suspect you have spun a bearing or it has collapsed......which is probably down to the lack of use. The bearing at the top of the crankshaft will not be lubricated unless running. Given the lack of use I would assume the top bearing has rusted (fuel attracts moisture) and has either spun itself or the remains of the bearing are in the motor.

This is why I don't do winter layups anymore, I just run my engine every couple of weeks all year round.


If the bearing has let go it isn't the end of the world if it has stayed intact, if it has went through the motor then it could be a write off though. If it has spun then perhaps the block can be fixed at a good machine shop with some kind of insert or the next size of bearing up etc.

I think you need to find out more about what has happened as this might be fixable and get you back on the water. Your dealer I assume is a normal outboard shop, they won't think outside the box normally as their job is order a part and whack it on. You want a machine shop for block work or maybe see if you can get a used power head or something.

Cheers
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Old 22 August 2015, 20:04   #27
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I ain't alone

Quick search. Gotta fish. Good reading.

BF 250 Thrust washer failure


Fishing Report Done with the CBBT for now and another BLOWN ENGINE!

Service Bulletin: Honda BF200/225/250 Thrust Washer/Bearing Failure

5th Blown Honda Powerhead Puts Me Out Again! | WalleyePete.com
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Old 23 August 2015, 04:24   #28
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I know it's a horrendous feeling when an engine blows up and especially with the cost to repair but now people know the age of the engine I doubt anyone will say honda are in the wrong. Yes it would be ace if they accepted it and tried to help but business is business these days and if every company repaired all failures out of warranty for free then I doubt they would be in business very long but would have a great reputation.

If I remember correctly even if you took the warranty from the date of sale it would still be out of warranty? I think you are fighting a lost cause especially here as everyone seems to agree with honda
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Old 23 August 2015, 05:17   #29
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Jklingel - nobody is suggesting you are alone, or even that you shouldn't be disappointed that on a moderately young, relatively low hours engine a component failure has happened which has killed the entire engine.

I think what people are probably suggesting is that it could happen to any manufacturer - and if you search enough you'll find disgruntled Suzuki, Etec, Mariner, and even Yamaha owners. Telling Honda they've lost a customer is a natural reaction (although you've not really been a Honda customer for 7 years!) - just be aware that whoever makes the engine you replace it with is not necessarily any more interested in the longevity of stuff 10 yrs after manufacture.

Good luck sourcing a replacement and a dealer who can provide you the local support and interface you need to have many more years of happy boating.
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Old 23 August 2015, 06:09   #30
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I'd say that Honda Service Bulletin is very reasonable - probably doing more than they legally needed to etc. But even if you'd had a 250 that was covered the extension of the warranty would be out of time. Perhaps you'd have managed to persuade them to cover it, perhaps you wouldn't. But its not a 250 and its out of time.
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