MCA and Southern Irish passenger rules and regs.

[Matal Mickey]

Purely for argument solving purposes, can anyone help with this query, it would solve a lot of bar talk in the boat club!
1. Can an MCA British coded, 12 passenger, boat, class three (we think) 30 miles from a safe haven use an Irish port to collect Irish fare paying passengers? Hypotethically say from Dublin/Dundalk to IOM and then Wales?
2. Is this journey legal under Irish marine rules and regs?
3. Is this journey legal under MCA rules and regs?
4. Can a North Irish registered and based MCA boat fully licensed by MCA, operate in Southern Irish waters collecting Southern Irish fare paying passengers from say Dundalk/Dublin etc?

The opposite question is:
1. Can an Irish boat of say their P3 catergory leave it's own port of Dundalk/Dublin and travel to the same destination IOM/Wales, or even Northern Ireland and operate?
2. Can an Irish registered P3 boat operate out of England or The Isle of Man, collecting British fare paying passengers for general trips?

Appreciate any useful comments on all this please. Forgive me if it sounds and looks confusing, we hope that you all get the basic query.

[Doug Stormforce]

Mickey

In simple terms a boat has to be coded under its own flag. i.e. if its British then under the British code. Regardless of where it operates it has to follow
the laws of its flag state and where coding is concerned its usual limits apply evene when outside territorial waters or in another countries waters.

Seperatly certain ports/countries impose extra rules but this is quite rare and I dont think the case in your examples.

[Matal Mickey]

Having gained substancial further information, regretably this is the answer to the original post. NO, we (British coded,registered passenger commercial boats) are not allowed to collect or drop off fare paying passengers from anywhere in Irish waters, Harbours and or Ports. We are catorgorically not allowed to operate (trade) in this marine business without firstly applying for a boat licence, Secondly, have our boats inspected and brought up to Irish Specification for passengers and finally, have our British Skippers and Crew tickets (qualifications) transfered to the Irish Marine equilivant.
What a shock! Anyone got any other input on this bombshell???

[Andy Gee]

Originally Posted by Matal Mickey

Purely for argument solving purposes, can anyone help with this query, it would solve a lot of bar talk in the boat club!
1. Can an MCA British coded, 12 passenger, boat, class three (we think) 30 miles from a safe haven use an Irish port to collect Irish fare paying passengers? Hypotethically say from Dublin/Dundalk to IOM and then Wales?
2. Is this journey legal under Irish marine rules and regs?
3. Is this journey legal under MCA rules and regs?
4. Can a North Irish registered and based MCA boat fully licensed by MCA, operate in Southern Irish waters collecting Southern Irish fare paying passengers from say Dundalk/Dublin etc?

The opposite question is:
1. Can an Irish boat of say their P3 catergory leave it's own port of Dundalk/Dublin and travel to the same destination IOM/Wales, or even Northern Ireland and operate?
2. Can an Irish registered P3 boat operate out of England or The Isle of Man, collecting British fare paying passengers for general trips?

Appreciate any useful comments on all this please. Forgive me if it sounds and looks confusing, we hope that you all get the basic query.

Vince,
I would have thought that you would have had previous experience of this having run to both the North and South.
Andy

[Matal Mickey]

Originally Posted by Andy Gee

Vince,
I would have thought that you would have had previous experience of this having run to both the North and South.
Andy

It is assumed that many many people would have known about this situation, however, not! Did you know or have any input on this important subject. Please enlighten all of us!

[Andy Gee]

Originally Posted by Matal Mickey

It is assumed that many many people would have known about this situation, however, not! Did you know or have any input on this important subject. Please enlighten all of us!

Vince,
As for "all of us" I see that you are the only one interested!!
As a Naval Arc/Surveyor you will know about the "Memorandum of Understanding" between European Member States and specifically Load Line Certificates.
Andy

[hobbit555]

I know this thread is very old.
Speaking from past experience and being stuck in ireland for a while, Taking a UK coded work boat to Eire is an absolute minefield including having STCW skipper and crew. The main problems we incured were paper work, and basically the irish surveyors having no ability to interperate the rules sensibily.
They wouldn't recgonise the code of practice certificates and we weren't even wanting to take passengers to sea.

[Rogue Wave]

Originally Posted by hobbit555

I know this thread is very old.
Speaking from past experience and being stuck in ireland for a while, Taking a UK coded work boat to Eire is an absolute minefield including having STCW skipper and crew. The main problems we incured were paper work, and basically the irish surveyors having no ability to interperate the rules sensibily.
They wouldn't recgonise the code of practice certificates and we weren't even wanting to take passengers to sea.

Weymouth You involved with Johnny tugboat!

[alant1]

Originally Posted by Matal Mickey

Purely for argument solving purposes, can anyone help with this query, it would solve a lot of bar talk in the boat club!
1. Can an MCA British coded, 12 passenger, boat, class three (we think) 30 miles from a safe haven use an Irish port to collect Irish fare paying passengers? Hypotethically say from Dublin/Dundalk to IOM and then Wales?
2. Is this journey legal under Irish marine rules and regs?
3. Is this journey legal under MCA rules and regs?
4. Can a North Irish registered and based MCA boat fully licensed by MCA, operate in Southern Irish waters collecting Southern Irish fare paying passengers from say Dundalk/Dublin etc?

The opposite question is:
1. Can an Irish boat of say their P3 catergory leave it's own port of Dundalk/Dublin and travel to the same destination IOM/Wales, or even Northern Ireland and operate?
2. Can an Irish registered P3 boat operate out of England or The Isle of Man, collecting British fare paying passengers for general trips?

Appreciate any useful comments on all this please. Forgive me if it sounds and looks confusing, we hope that you all get the basic query.

__________________________________________________ _______________

I do some freelance skippering work with a UK based Shipping Company, who sometimes need to send British flagged workboats to Ireland.
Normally, since there are never more that 12 people aboard + most are British crew, these can be operated in UK with a commercially endorsed RYA certificate.

However, in Ireland, they will not recognise these & insist upon STCW 95 + Master 200 qualifications. This is also the case in a number of other euro countries, including Denmark.

[Andy Gee]

Originally Posted by alant1

__________________________________________________ _______________

I do some freelance skippering work with a UK based Shipping Company, who sometimes need to send British flagged workboats to Ireland.
Normally, since there are never more that 12 people aboard + most are British crew, these can be operated in UK with a commercially endorsed RYA certificate.

However, in Ireland, they will not recognise these & insist upon STCW 95 + Master 200 qualifications. This is also the case in a number of other euro countries, including Denmark.

A lot of these Euro problems are being addressed in the new Boatmasters Certificate, however some of the major players in the tug world are not very happy about this and think that it will now all be to easy to get a licence for the big (25t + bollard pull) tugs and want some form of restricition put on them.
Andy