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Old 16 June 2011, 17:52   #1
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Fuel rebate

Hi,

Does a vessel have to be coded for 12 passengers before duty can be claimed for fuel?

HMRC states that the duty can be claimed on the following voyages; ''marine voyages of boats used for pleasure trips carrying paying passengers''

A passenger vessel is any vessel carrying 12 or more passengers, however the above does not state a passenger vessel, instead a 'vessel' carrying paying passengers. The way I read this even if a V/L which can only carry 4 passengers can claim?

I have been told by several people that the V/L must be coded for 12. Can somebody clarify?


Also, must I be VAT registered before I can claim? If not how much could I claim back at current fuel prices.

Thanks

Johnny
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Old 16 June 2011, 18:28   #2
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There is no requirement to be coded for 12 or to carry 12 passengers in order to reclaim duty.

The benefit of being a 12 person or more passenger vessel is you are 0 VAT rated.
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Old 17 June 2011, 02:26   #3
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here is another Ribnet link to fuel reclaim
New fuel duty

and a link to the fuel duty reclaim rules and forms
HO 50 - Claim for repayment of Excise Duty on mineral (hydrocarbon) oil used on board a vessel or hovercraft (other than a private pleasure craft) on a marine voyage

and you do not need to be VAT registered to claim fuel duty back when used for commercial use. I think the figure if minimum 200 but that is on the links. Regards Ian
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Old 17 June 2011, 02:38   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Stormforce View Post
There is no requirement to be coded for 12 or to carry 12 passengers in order to reclaim duty.

The benefit of being a 12 person or more passenger vessel is you are 0 VAT rated.
The zero rating for VAT applies providing you have at least 10 seats - http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsP...yType=document

The number coded for does not however affect your ability to claim back the excise duty.

Michael
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Old 17 June 2011, 04:28   #5
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Just as a matter of intrest, does any one know how far back you can claim for, as i was told by my accountant that i needed to be VAT registerd so didn't bother following up.
Cheers
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Old 17 June 2011, 07:58   #6
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You can claim back upto 3 years in the past, however, your total claim must be greater than 250 (I think) There is no limit on the amount of claims you can submit say you burn stacks of fuel say over the 250 claim size per month then you can claim monthly.

You are claiming back the road fund duty component of the fuel as it has not been burnt "on the road" You are not claiming back VAT. It does not matter if you are VAT registered or not.
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Old 17 June 2011, 08:17   #7
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"You are claiming back the road fund duty component of the fuel as it has not been burnt "on the road" You are not claiming back VAT. It does not matter if you are VAT registered or not."

But VAT is charged on top of the RFD. So if you're reclaiming the RFD, then you've overpaid the VAT - or am missing something?
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Old 17 June 2011, 11:39   #8
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The zero rating for VAT applies providing you have at least 10 seats - HM Revenue & Customs

The number coded for does not however affect your ability to claim back the excise duty.

Michael
I see the section where it says 10 seats including those for driver and crew, however it also states;

''4.5 What if I supply vehicles, ships or aircraft with a carrying capacity of less than 10 passengers?
If the carrying capacity of the vehicle, ship or aircraft is less than 10 passengers, then the passenger transport is standard-rated unless it can be zero-rated under the conditions:

■set out in section 3, 5 and 7, or
■for disabled passengers, in specially adapted vehicles (see section 6).''

Does this mean that it must have 10 seats but should also be coded for 12 persons including skipper and one crew to be zero vat registered? i.e. as long as it has 10 seats AND is coded to carry 10 passengers, not 8 pax and 2 crew.

Thanks to all the comments and info so far. I now know that a vessel does not need to be coded for a particular number of pax to claim fuel duty which I believe is currently around 58p/litre, however, to claim back the additional VAT (22p/litre) should the vessel be zero VAT rated?

Also, to have a zero VAT rated V/L would I as a business have to be VAT registered. Sorry if these questions seem stupid but am having trouble getting my head around it all!
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Old 17 June 2011, 18:42   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyAVT View Post
I see the section where it says 10 seats including those for driver and crew, however it also states;

''4.5 What if I supply vehicles, ships or aircraft with a carrying capacity of less than 10 passengers?
If the carrying capacity of the vehicle, ship or aircraft is less than 10 passengers, then the passenger transport is standard-rated unless it can be zero-rated under the conditions:

set out in section 3, 5 and 7, or
for disabled passengers, in specially adapted vehicles (see section 6).''

Does this mean that it must have 10 seats but should also be coded for 12 persons including skipper and one crew to be zero vat registered? i.e. as long as it has 10 seats AND is coded to carry 10 passengers, not 8 pax and 2 crew.

Thanks to all the comments and info so far. I now know that a vessel does not need to be coded for a particular number of pax to claim fuel duty which I believe is currently around 58p/litre, however, to claim back the additional VAT (22p/litre) should the vessel be zero VAT rated?

Also, to have a zero VAT rated V/L would I as a business have to be VAT registered. Sorry if these questions seem stupid but am having trouble getting my head around it all!
I had this conversation with the VAT office a couple of years back and was told that being coded for 10 in total met the criteria for being zero rated.

The zero rating means that as a VAT registered business, we not have to charge VAT on our sales relating to passenger transport. We can however still claim the VAT back on all our purchases (including fuel). If you are not VAT registered, the zero rating does not apply.

Michael
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Old 24 June 2011, 19:48   #10
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Thanks for all the info. Was a big help. Cheers
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