Largs yacht haven unhappy boaters

[beamishken]

We berth our cruiser in Largs yacht haven & have several friends who also berth there & I assume probably a few ribnet members too
The marina offer a dry berth facility for boats up to around 30ft which is quite popular with ribs & smaller cruisers etc. Boats are launched by marina staff with a tractor.
Recently a member of staff was moving a 30ft motorcat towards its trailer when apparently one of the outboards stuck on wot the result was 3 damaged ribs & the motorcat perched across one of them. The marina staff decided to sink said rib to free the motorcat from it almost certainly writing the boat off

Yacht havens have told the boat owners to claim off there own insurers as they have to carry insurance as part of there berthing terms & have been totally unhelpfull towards the aggrieved owners
surely this cannot be correct the marina should be making good damage done by there own staff?*
Can anyone confirm the legal position?*
Whilst my boat wasn't damaged I'm obviously concerned that if it was then I'd be left claiming from my own insurers rather than the people who did the damage

On another note there was recently a sailing event taking place & the rear gate into the boat yard was left open from 8 am till 9 pm as the rear of the yard was used as a temporary camp site for the dinghy sailors. This meant unchecked access to the entire boat yard for all & sundry -result 7 outboards stolen in one week - Marina's reaction 'keep it quiet'*
How can they get away with it ?*
Anyone else had problems in a marina & is this typical?

[bartiny]

I am no expert but; I think that would be normal practice to claim off your own insurance (just like you do with car insurance) and let the insurance company sort it out with the marina.

[Trimix]

Sounds quite wrong on both counts. But you should check the small print in your contract with them just to see what it does say.

Id also ring your insurer / broker and find out if you would have been covered had it been your boat.

Id also ask to renegotiate my contract with the marina as this is not good. See what the others think as well.

[beamishken]

My boat isn't kept on the dry berth but could easily have been a victim & I would expect any damage done while my boat is moored to be covered by the insurance of the person doing the damage not mine!
Anything that is damaged in an accident is the responsibility of the person doing the damage be it a house car fence caravan etc if you crash into it you can't just walk away shrug & say well never mind you have insurance!
I'd have to dig out the agreement but if this is the case I'll be moving the boat at the first opportunity unfortunately I just paid for the next year at the start of August
There attitude to security also stinks keeping thefts quiet instead of warning others to be vigilant

[ashbypower]

Lets get this right, they deliberately sunk the RiB?? Mmmm not sure what the insurance would make of that.. I'm no expert but that rings alarm bells to me....

"Sorry I want to claim for some repair work" That's ok sir, what happened?.. "Mmm well my boat was in the way of a recovery, so we sunk the boat!!"

[Poly]

Liability will, to some extent, depend on the T&Cs the boat owners have with the marina. There may be some forms of liability they can't contract out of and the degree of negligence the (or their staff) displayed will be a significant factor in that - but it is far easier to let your own insurer handle the dispute and cross claims etc - especially when there are multiple boats involved. I'd say the downside of having a claim on your record is probably worth it for the hassle saved. What if they offer to repair some damage themselves then you weren't happy with the work - its all a mess.

I'm amazed that with the gate left open for 1 day (when presumably there were lots of people around) that 7 motors got nicked. I've kept my boat in various places (which I wont name for obvious reasons) which have had pretty lax security on a regular basis, and none have had that sort of a problem. The cynic in me wonders how the thieves knew that security would be reduced at that particular point?

[beamishken]

Ashby power- the marina staff sunk the rib before the owner got there
Poly- the gate was open for a week it was the laser nationals my boat was out of the water due to a bust engine & there were campers all around the boat.
Whilst I wouldn't suspect any of the dinghy sailors there was ample opportunity during briefings and bad weather when everyone was in the club house for anyone to enter unchallenged
Security isn't great at the best of times but leaving a gate open to a public car park is asking for trouble
I questioned why the gates were open after the first day & was told 'we always do that during events'
Seems strange berth holders paying thousands have to enter through a security barrier but not strangers
Possibly the thefts were not linked to the event but keeping quiet about 7 motors going missing in one week rather than warning people just stinks

[ashbypower]

Seems to my untrained mind that the Marina is wholly responsible for the actions of their staff, and its likely the Insurance company would walk away from any claim !!!

[paddlers]

Small print usually with this type of thing !

Do you sign any form of disclaimer ??

[Boatnomad]

Very disappointing,can see why their site says;

"All boats using the marina facility, ashore or afloat, must have a minimum of £3,000,000 third party insurance"

[thomas]

I damaged a boat in Chichester while on a boat handling course with a numpty instructor and bent the bow roller on a Beneteau, was clearly our fault, our boat insurance paid up and there was no way anyone could argue.

This case is exactly the same, a bloke driving a boat caused damage to another boat, the boat at fault is liable, the marina staff will be covered as they probably move much more expensive things around.

Marine insurance companies are very good and will sort it all out between themselves, chances are both boats are insured through the same company anyway.

How do you get an outboard stuck on WOT anyhow?? would love to see the CCTV

[bartiny]

Originally Posted by Boatnomad

Very disappointing,can see why their site says;

"All boats using the marina facility, ashore or afloat, must have a minimum of £3,000,000 third party insurance"

I thought this was just standard insurance, that is the minimum cover I have for my SIB.

[Bigmuz7]

The same marina ended up leaving an 8.5M rib of mine full of rain water that wrecked its electrics whilst on dry berth because they didnt take the deck bung out /drop tube as instructed and must have added a tonne or so of weight to the trailer ...... a while later it had a delaminated transom ... and I never got to the bottom of why this was ..... I think I have a marina contract in my drawer somewhere

Edit .. I was also asked if my boat could be used for safety work for an up coming regatta at one time which I declined ... but I think they used it anyway

[MustRib]

Originally Posted by thomas

How do you get an outboard stuck on WOT anyhow?? would love to see the CCTV

kill cord ??

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Originally Posted by Bigmuz7

The same marina ended up leaving an 8.5M rib of mine full of rain water that wrecked its electrics whilst on dry berth because they didnt take the deck bung out /drop tube as instructed and must have added a tonne or so of weight to the trailer ...... a while later it had a delaminated transom ... and I never got to the bottom of why this was ..... I think I have a marina contract in my drawer somewhere

Edit .. I was also asked if my boat could be used for safety work for an up coming regatta at one time which I declined ... but I think they used it anyway

How did a boat full of rain water get near the electrics? Bad design?

Why would the transom delaminate from some fresh water? Bad design?

How did they use your boat? Why do they have keys for your boat?

I wouldn't be gap with happy with any of the above!

[biffer]

You can't design out the electrics problem if you've a boat full to the transom height unless you put them in the top of the console, you could seal the seat pods for batteries maybe but that has it's own problems of holding any water that gets in the top.
Doesn't matter what type of water you get in the ply, it will feck it, that is bad work as it should be totally sealed, you may not be able to blame the builder as fitting the engine or any other screws into it could have the same result

[Bigmuz7]

Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL

How did a boat full of rain water get near the electrics?

Starting with this one ...... Where yo gonna put the battery ? Above the tubes ? I meant a boat FULL of water

[biffer]

I would say that liability should be with the company that did the damage, you wouldn't expect to sort out yourself if your car was parked in a car park and the attendant damaged it

[Poly]

They'll need the keys if the offer a launch and recovery service.

Bigmuz previously did raise concerns about the build quality of the transom. There are a lot of ribs that if you put enough rain water in will find its was to the batteries etc. It's not ideal but bungs and trunks are designed to prevent it.

Stuck on wot is possible. Something similar happened to me after I bodged refittingthe throttle and gear cables. I eventually pulled the kill cord but if there had been anything fragile in the way it would have caused a lot of damage in that two seconds it takes to realise, Decide and take action.

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Originally Posted by Bigmuz7

Starting with this one ...... Where yo gonna put the battery ? Above the tubes ? I meant a boat FULL of water

Erm. Most bigger ribs have a shelf in the console above the flooded waterline so if you stuff, they're fine..... (Roll eyes)

Don't mean to be antagonistic. I thought most were like this, those I've seen are. Ribquest/ribcraft/Humber etc if 6m or more.

Re keys, fair point but I wouldn't leave keys with "staff" for exactly that reason.

And the tea some shouldn't "delaminate" at all.