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Old 20 April 2009, 18:50   #11
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Yes .. but Harry Stanley bent down on one knee and pointed his chair leg at an armed copper who was shouting 'Armed Police!' ..from many yards away .. what were they supposed to think / or do when he refused to drop it ? .. plus they knew he had previous I think

Anyway what the feck has this got to do with the fact airguns are going to get banned or licensed?

That bit didn't but I did think the rest of my post was quite illustrative of what can and does happen and I honestly thought it would be helpful in answering your question..............
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Old 20 April 2009, 19:26   #12
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Why should I have to? I bought it perfectly legally.
rules change - learn to live with it. otherwise you'll just end up old and bitter --- oops too late!
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I can't recall EVER having wandered the streets with it!!!
I wasn't suggesting YOU did. Unfortunately other people do and its not realistic to make rules for one person and not others.
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So you also want ALL toy guns to be banned - also waterpistols and anything else that looks even remotely gun like.
I haven't suggested that I want a BAN on all guns or airguns; but that things which look like real guns should be regulated more like real guns and I would extend that to so called toys if they are realistic. I'm not talking about fluorescent yellow super soakers, or the mini pistol that comes in christmas cracker - but things which are intended to look like real weapons and thus create fear should be.
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The ONLY people I have ever seen wandeing the streets of Swansea with guns have been the Police
so you don't think that people in S. Wales ever carry real or replica hand guns? Your comment suggests that no one had ever threatened you with a weapon - perhaps your views would be different if you had (even a pretend) one pointed at you.
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Old 20 April 2009, 20:58   #13
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Gun crime is exceptionally low in the whole of the UK - excluding some of the biggest cities.

In 2007 for example there were only 59 gun related murders in the whole of the UK!!!

The last policeman shot dead in South Wales was in 1940 something by the IRA and in Bristol it was in something like 1860.

The main reson they claim firearms incidence are up is because of the way it's all reported - now a water pistol carried by a 12 yr old is called a firearms incident and is attended by armed officers - a very dangerous escalation.

If the gun crimes figures are still so low why are more and more police carrying guns?

There was a high profile event in Swansea where they had police waving H+K MP3s all over the place. I strongly object to having a trigger happy copper pointing a H+K at me which they did to every car that came through their roadblock. The whole fiasco was called operation Jaguar - on that particular day they arrested 30 people - for such serious crimes as drugs - outstanding warrents - car crime and non payment of fines.

So yes i I have had a real gun pointed at me in Swansea and it wasn't nice. Was it justified? You tell me - the offences picked up were the usual run of the mill stuff that traditional British Bobbies used to deal with a truncheon.

It was authorised by Barbara Wilding - the same woman who set up the team that killed the Brazillian - it hasn't made me feel any safer............
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Old 21 April 2009, 01:47   #14
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I think the reason the likes of Brocock were banned was that you could easily convert them into an illegal firearm.
It'll be a real shame if air guns do get banned, they're already stopped you ordering them mail order. Granted if you want one you'll go buy one regardless. I was bored at work and was going to order a Crosman ratcatcher, could because I was on nights, no mail order. I spent the money on boat bits instead!
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Old 21 April 2009, 03:40   #15
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I agree with you on the brocock thoughts, I know of some one who turned an insert so a .22 rimfire could be fired - rather stupid really, I have seen the results of a Lee Enfield No.4 have a breach explosion - that lad will never be the same again
When I used to live near Bath and Bristol I saw quite a few handguns which were not in the hands of the law.
I do get the impression that some members of the government and police would like to see anything that could be dangerous banned (and enlist the knee jerk campaigning papers to help). In the country side and towns it would be back to poisoning and snares for vermin and deer control. I would not like to see that as its not a nice way to go and I don't like kids etc finding the carcasses.
Also I think its daft that our sportsmen and women have to go to another country to practice to represent our country and the Olympic ranges will be destroyed after use - what was that about a legacy...
well that's enough from me this is turning into a rant, sorry
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Old 21 April 2009, 04:02   #16
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Gun crime is exceptionally low in the whole of the UK - excluding some of the biggest cities. etc etc etc
congratulations on one of you most spectacular evasive moves to date - that sort of skill will see you move from the back benches to the front when you take up office
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There was a high profile event in Swansea where they had police waving H+K MP3s all over the place. I strongly object to having a trigger happy copper pointing a H+K at me which they did to every car that came through their roadblock. The whole fiasco was called operation Jaguar - on that particular day they arrested 30 people - for such serious crimes as drugs - outstanding warrents - car crime and non payment of fines.

So yes i I have had a real gun pointed at me in Swansea and it wasn't nice. Was it justified? You tell me - the offences picked up were the usual run of the mill stuff that traditional British Bobbies used to deal with a truncheon.
You didn't like it when it was a police man, who is supposed to be highly trained, has very strict procedures to follow etc - then you really won't like it when its some teenager trying to look big in front of his mates.

At the risk of digressing I'm not advocating more armed police, if anything tougher controls on replica weapons and air rifles should reduce the "demand" for armed officers.
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Old 21 April 2009, 04:35   #17
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..I haven't suggested that I want a BAN on all guns or airguns; but that things which look like real guns should be regulated more like real guns and I would extend that to so called toys if they are realistic. ...
They already are. Check out the VCR bill.
Should airguns be better regulated?
The laws on use and purchase are already quite strict and potential breaches can have serious punishments, however the transgressions are not punished severely enough to be effective. Airguns, especially rifles, can cause lethal injuries as we have seen. They can also be used to inflict horrendous injuries on wild life either maliciously or through poor marksmanship even when used against legitimate prey.
Will extra legislation help? There are so many air rifles in circulation that Im not sure it would be feasible to remove them all off those people who dont choose to become licensed. I think we are too far down the road to go that way. What we should be doing is properly punishing those who misuse them and allowing those who enjoy them safely, within the confines of current legislation, to carry on doing so.
Just for info Im FAC, SGCd up to the hilt and use air rifle for some vermin control when other methods fail or are inappropriate, so licensing them is no big deal to me..
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Old 21 April 2009, 05:09   #18
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IMHO all types of gun should be banned. You can still kill someone with one of these! Someone made reference to the work "weapon" - thats exactly what they are. With reference to being shot with chair legs/bags etc, my attitude is that if you co-operate with the police you won't get shot. Waving something that could be a gun at them is probably not a great idea....Running into a tube station looking like a terrorist whilst there are a load of armed police running after you and shouting is a prime example.
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Old 21 April 2009, 05:26   #19
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IMHO all types of gun should be banned. You can still kill someone with one of these! ....
What interesting logic. How do you propose to control everything that can be used to kill?
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Old 21 April 2009, 05:27   #20
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Legislation! Cigarettes, knives, solvents.....guns?
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